{ "slug": "knees-over-toes", "name": "Knees over toes", "aliases": [ "ATG", "kneesovertoesguy", "Patrick training", "tibialis raises", "ATG split squat" ], "family": "stretch", "heat": "high", "talk": "Lots of talk", "mostDiscussed": false, "firstLine": "Knees-over-toes training is a label associated with exercises that allow forward knee travel, including the split squats, backward sled work and lower-leg exercises discussed around the ATG method.", "whyLine": "People compare individual drills, easier and harder variations, equipment needs and how this approach differs from the old cue to keep knees behind toes.", "feelWords": [ "knees over toes", "ATG", "tibialis", "split squat", "patrick" ], "commonPicture": [ { "lead": "Front-foot elevation changes split-squat range demand", "why": "Support and added load change separate parts of the exercise. [community]" }, { "lead": "Extra-work reports: 10–20 minutes, 2–3 days weekly", "why": "Examples use 15–25 shin-raise reps and 8–15 split-squat reps per side. [community]" } ], "watchFor": "Copying a six-day ATG program despite knee pain, bouncing into the end position, or treating the routine as a replacement for a surgical assessment.", "whatPeopleSay": [ "**The job:** make the knee happy going forward so a squat or a step-down is not a fear. [community]", "**KneesOverToesGuy and ATG (Athletic Truth Group)** are names associated with this approach in online training discussions. [community]", "**r/kneesovertoes and r/flexibility** vs old “knees never past toes” school-PE. [community]", "**Why people stay:** stairs and split squats feel less scary after a month. [community]", "**Physical therapists’ concern:** copying a reel can mean forcing a painful end range without an individual assessment. [community]", "**Not a squat program.** 5/3/1 still squats. This is extra knee capacity. [community]", "**Not couch stretch.** Couch stretch is hip flexor. This is knee travel. [community]", "**“Bulletproof knees” is marketing language,** not a guaranteed outcome from a set of drills. [community]", "**Pain during vs after:** a little work-sore is common; sharp line-pain is a stop. [community]", "**Beginners** do a short-range split squat to a pad, not a deficit ATG day one. [community]", "**It will not un-do a torn meniscus on a video.** [community]" ], "howPeopleRunIt": [ "**Common drill lists include 2–3 movements:** tibialis raises, which lift the front of the foot to work the shin muscles; split squats; and sometimes step-downs. [community]", "**Slow.** They own the bottom. [community]", "**2–3 days a week** as extra, often after easy cardio or before lifts. [community]", "**Front-foot elevation is a regression:** the ATG explanation uses a higher front-foot platform to reduce the range demand. Lowering that platform makes the range challenge greater; added weight is a separate change. [community]", "**Heel and platform cues differ:** ATG split-squat explanations can allow the front heel to rise. That is different from elevating the entire front foot on a platform. [community]", "**They stop a set** when the knee line gets angry, not when the reel hits 10. [community]", "**Sled backwards** if they have one and the knee likes it. [community]" ], "amountsPeopleUse": [ "**Tib raises:** often **15–25** slow reps. [community]", "**Split squats:** **8–15**/side, bodyweight first. [community]", "**Frequency:** **2–3 days / week.** [community]", "**Session time:** **10–20 minutes** extra, not a 90-minute ATG religion. [community]", "**Progress:** more range, then a little load — not both at once. [community]" ], "howPeopleKeepIt": [ "**A short list on a note** so it is not a 40-exercise app. [community]", "**They pair it with walking.** [community]", "**They skip deficit work** when the knee is already loud. [community]", "**Shoes they can feel the floor in.** [community]", "**A PT or a coach** if the knee already has a name (surgery, swelling). [community]" ], "howItFeels": [ "**First tib workout:** shins sore in a new way. Walks funny the next day. [community]", "**Split squat bottom:** stretch and respect, or a pinch they should not push. [community]", "**After a few weeks:** stairs feel less like a negotiation. [community]", "**Ego deficit:** they limp and blame the method. [community]", "**Good day:** knee tracks, heel stays, they forget the cue. [community]", "**Swelling after:** they did too much range too fast. [community]" ], "howLongPeopleRunIt": [ "**A 4–8 week introduction** is how most logs start. [community]", "**Then it becomes a 10-minute extra** or it dies. [community]", "**Not a 12-month paid program unless they want that.** [community]", "**They return** after a layoff at the short range. [community]" ], "deepDive": [ "**Couch stretch / 90/90** is hips. This is knees traveling. [community]", "**Ten-minute mobility** can host tib raises without an ATG identity. [community]", "**First gym week** should learn a squat that feels safe, not a deficit ATG. [community]", "**An exercise approach and a drug treatment are separate questions.** The drill name does not supply a medicine plan. [community]", "**Sports-medicine nuance:** some people report knee pain near the end of a movement's range. General discussion cannot diagnose an individual's knee pain. [community]" ], "watchForLong": [ "**Sharp pain, locking, giving-way:** a clinician, not a deeper split squat. [community]", "**Copying the full ATG program** the first week. [community]", "**Bouncing out of the bottom.** [community]", "**Treating it as surgery replacement.** [community]", "**Loading a stretch they cannot control.** [community]" ], "related": [ "couch-stretch", "ten-minute-mobility", "first-gym-week", "starting-strength", "pull-up-progress" ], "researchPointer": [], "housePointers": [], "playPointer": null, "sources": [ "ATG / KneesOverToesGuy 2020s method talk", "r/kneesovertoes", "r/flexibility knee-travel threads" ], "disclaimer": "Community talk may be wrong. Not medical, training, or diet advice. Sharp pain, fainting, or disordered-eating concerns need a clinician.", "quickAnswerHistory": [ { "field": "commonPicture", "rows": [ { "lead": "ATG split squat", "why": "The named pattern. [community]" }, { "lead": "Tibialis raise", "why": "The shin muscle Instagram discovered. [community]" } ] }, { "field": "howPeopleRunIt", "rows": [ "**Pick 2–3 drills:** tib raise, split squat to a comfortable depth, maybe a step-down. [community]", "**They raise height of the front foot later,** not week one. [community]", "**They keep the heel down** when the cue says so. [community]" ] }, { "field": "firstLine", "rows": [ "Knees-over-toes is the ATG / Patrick-style work: let the knee travel, train the tibialis, split-squat deep." ] }, { "field": "whyLine", "rows": [ "Knees-over-toes is the ATG / Patrick-style work: let the knee travel, train the tibialis, split-squat deep." ] }, { "field": "commonPicture", "rows": [ { "lead": "Knee is allowed forward", "why": "The whole argument with 1990s PT posters. [community]" }, { "lead": "ATG split squat: deep split-stance squat", "why": "An easier setup or smaller range is one version in the discussion. [community]" }, { "lead": "Tibialis raise: lift the front of the foot", "why": "This targets the shin-side muscles referred to by the shorter exercise name. [community]" }, { "lead": "Slow and high-rep first", "why": "Not a one-rep-max in a deficit. [community]" }, { "lead": "Sled backwards optional", "why": "Gyms that have a sled. [community]" }, { "lead": "Reported extras: 10–20 minutes, 2–3 days a week", "why": "The notes give 15–25 shin-raise reps and 8–15 split-squat reps per side. [community]" } ] }, { "field": "whatPeopleSay", "rows": [ "**KneesOverToesGuy / ATG** is the 2020s brand. 2026 rooms still search the phrase. [community]", "**Why PTs roll their eyes:** some clients smash into painful end range because a reel said so. [community]", "**Bulletproof knees** marketing is a promise. This map does not promise. [community]" ] }, { "field": "deepDive", "rows": [ "**Research compounds do not live here.** [community]", "**Sports-med nuance:** some knees hate end-range. The map is talk, not a diagnosis. [community]" ] } ] }